RTD probe experiment...

[680bear]

so things have been working relatively well with the pit boss probe,,, I unfortunately don't have the specifics on the internal construction of the PB probe wether it's platinum or copper or nickel,,, but it is clearly out performing the original RecTec probe...
Next up for testing is the Savannah Stoker probe,,,
https://www.savannahstoker.com/products/grill-temperature-sensor
it is a platinum RTD,,, all the specs are on their site,,,
I work with a number of different types of RTD probes at work and are designed for an industrial setting in harsh environments,,, the probes that are in these grills are simply stripped down versions of simular 2 wire probes,,, they are simple devices that change their resistance value along an assumed temperature range,,, accuracy is determined by the quality of the material used in it's construction,,, and the quality of the device and the programming in the device... I am somewhat convinced the device/controller is a quality device,,, I am very suspect on the quality of the RTD probe supplied with the grill...

 

[Mastertech59]

so things have been working relatively well with the pit boss probe,,, I unfortunately don't have the specifics on the internal construction of the PB probe wether it's platinum or copper or nickel,,, but it is clearly out performing the original RecTec probe...
Next up for testing is the Savannah Stoker probe,,,
https://www.savannahstoker.com/products/grill-temperature-sensor
it is a platinum RTD,,, all the specs are on their site,,,
I work with a number of different types of RTD probes at work and are designed for an industrial setting in harsh environments,,, the probes that are in these grills are simply stripped down versions of simular 2 wire probes,,, they are simple devices that change their resistance value along an assumed temperature range,,, accuracy is determined by the quality of the material used in it's construction,,, and the quality of the device and the programming in the device... I am somewhat convinced the device/controller is a quality device,,, I am very suspect on the quality of the RTD probe supplied with the grill...

Keep us posted on your results and thanks for doing this experiment.

 

[680bear]

So I will give you guys a little history as to why I started this endeavor... I got a papa murphys pizza and set the temp on the 680 to 425 and put in my pizza stone... (this is before the RTD swap but with the thermoworks probe set right next to the RTD..) So the grill reached 425 on both and I threw in the pizza for the allotted time,,, and it came out terribly burnt... I checked the temp of the pizza stone (the grill still read 425...) and my IR instant read showed my pizza stone at 530°!!! So that is what started this project,,, and here is where it stands now... I have closed the offset gap to the point where I can say I trust it through the temp range that I cook at,,, I have also tackled the Hotspot issue in the center of the grill by adding a pan with some ceramic grill stones to disperse the heat more evenly,,, doing this also tightened up the offset setting so at this point I don't think I will be needing to adjust it much if at all throughout the temp range that I cook (225-425)... temp swings are now virtually nonexistent,,, (2-6 degrees at most...) (the picture shows the pan with the ceramic grill stones,,, I had to take a few off the top so the drip pan would sit down all the way...)

 

[okie]

So I will give you guys a little history as to why I started this endeavor... I got a papa murphys pizza and set the temp on the 680 to 425 and put in my pizza stone... (this is before the RTD swap but with the thermoworks probe set right next to the RTD..) So the grill reached 425 on both and I threw in the pizza for the allotted time,,, and it came out terribly burnt... I checked the temp of the pizza stone (the grill still read 425...) and my IR instant read showed my pizza stone at 530°!!! So that is what started this project,,, and here is where it stands now... I have closed the offset gap to the point where I can say I trust it through the temp range that I cook at,,, I have also tackled the Hotspot issue in the center of the grill by adding a pan with some ceramic grill stones to disperse the heat more evenly,,, doing this also tightened up the offset setting so at this point I don't think I will be needing to adjust it much if at all throughout the temp range that I cook (225-425)... temp swings are now virtually nonexistent,,, (2-6 degrees at most...) (the picture shows the pan with the ceramic grill stones,,, I had to take a few off the top so the drip pan would sit down all the way...)

Looks like you have the 680 fine tuned. Congrats. As for the same on the B380 I went ahead and ordered the PB short (30mm) replacement and also ordered the 3.5 inch because it has the extension cord giving it a total of 23 inches. or so. ie I am robbing from the longer probe set to get the extension for the shorter probe. Plus I can adapt the wire ends to spade lug females for the control board. Will take the old probe off and save in case---. I think you are correct in that the controls probably are fine, but the probes are poor. As far as the briquets go, it did not help the wide swings at all.. Offset already done and got the most correction at +18. (as have most I have seen who have done so). Will do the new probe when the next good weather is here. Also, excuse me for hijacking your space. Just realized that. so will continue on a new thread when I get er done.

 

[okie]

I have also done the same and I was ridiculed on a FB group by several for doing so... the fanboys got upset I guess. RecTeq even saw my post and emailed me and said the RTD probe takes an average ambient temp. Which makes sense so the controller feeds the right amount of pellets I guess. But I also was very skeptical and see lots of people sing praise after praise over these dead locked temps. Well, they aren't deadlocked at all. I don't think any pellet grill can be that accurate due to the fuel source being used.

Another person said my test was flawed because my probes were on the grates. Well, news flash that's where the important temp is at because that's where the food is !

I still love my 590 but anyone who thinks these temps are that accurate is very gullible

 

[680bear]

Looks like you have the 680 fine tuned. Congrats. As for the same on the B380 I went ahead and ordered the PB short (30mm) replacement and also ordered the 3.5 inch because it has the extension cord giving it a total of 23 inches. or so. ie I am robbing from the longer probe set to get the extension for the shorter probe. Plus I can adapt the wire ends to spade lug females for the control board. Will take the old probe off and save in case---. I think you are correct in that the controls probably are fine, but the probes are poor. As far as the briquets go, it did not help the wide swings at all.. Offset already done and got the most correction at +18. (as have most I have seen who have done so). Will do the new probe when the next good weather is here. Also, excuse me for hijacking your space. Just realized that. so will continue on a new thread when I get er done.

no worries,,, if we can all contribute and learn from each other it just makes things that much better for everyone,,, if what I am doing here with my 680 helps out someone even if they don't have the same grill,,, it's all worth it...

 

[TyYoda]

Looks like you have the 680 fine tuned. Congrats. As for the same on the B380 I went ahead and ordered the PB short (30mm) replacement and also ordered the 3.5 inch because it has the extension cord giving it a total of 23 inches. or so. ie I am robbing from the longer probe set to get the extension for the shorter probe. Plus I can adapt the wire ends to spade lug females for the control board. Will take the old probe off and save in case---. I think you are correct in that the controls probably are fine, but the probes are poor. As far as the briquets go, it did not help the wide swings at all.. Offset already done and got the most correction at +18. (as have most I have seen who have done so). Will do the new probe when the next good weather is here. Also, excuse me for hijacking your space. Just realized that. so will continue on a new thread when I get er done.

I never was able to get my B380 stabilized and often saw 70F drops in temps. RecTeq told me it was normal. I returned it and bought a 590.

I also see the variability in the 590 offset at different temperature ranges. I thought the offset issue was random so my solution has been to monitor the grill temp with a probe set on oven mode and manually adjust the grill temp (usually no more than +/-10F to dial in the smoker to the correct set point.

Good to hear that there is a solution to the variable offset at different temperatures issue. I look forward to hearing the results from the platinum probe test.

 

[okie]

I never was able to get my B380 stabilized and often saw 70F drops in temps. RecTeq told me it was normal. I returned it and bought a 590.

I also see the variability in the 590 offset at different temperature ranges. I thought the offset issue was random so my solution has been to monitor the grill temp with a probe set on oven mode and manually adjust the grill temp (usually no more than +/-10F to dial in the smoker to the correct set point.

Good to hear that there is a solution to the variable offset at different temperatures issue. I look forward to hearing the results from the platinum probe test.

Have ordered an aftermarket RTD of about the same length as original. Weather permitting I will give it a trial, but no assurances it will be any better than the original. Can't be any worse?? Not sure of high temp limits. Will see. Will carefully preserve the original. I think easy enough to get to.

 

[okie]

Yes,,, I did a rack of spare ribs before I changed the RTD,,, results were close to the same,,, and I did a bunch of chicken after the RTD change and my results were almost identical to what I found with no meat... I am almost thoroughly convinced that the original RTD probes that come in our smokers are too long and are of inferior quality...

Do you have any info as to the max heat range of the after market RTD? I have the 30mm (1.24 inches) in the 380 and just bought the Pit Boss replacement unit of the same length, but have not installed. Concerned about the max heat tolerance. As you know the Bullseye can get to 750*. Have not found any ref. to max heat tolerance. ???

 

[C. Keeper]

Do you have any info as to the max heat range of the after market RTD? I have the 30mm (1.24 inches) in the 380 and just bought the Pit Boss replacement unit of the same length, but have not installed. Concerned about the max heat tolerance. As you know the Bullseye can get to 750*. Have not found any ref. to max heat tolerance. ???

Not having details but a possible high of 850 degrees.

 

[680bear]

Do you have any info as to the max heat range of the after market RTD? I have the 30mm (1.24 inches) in the 380 and just bought the Pit Boss replacement unit of the same length, but have not installed. Concerned about the max heat tolerance. As you know the Bullseye can get to 750*. Have not found any ref. to max heat tolerance. ???

To the best of my knowledge most RTD probes in this class are good to 1200° ...

 

[okie]

To the best of my knowledge most RTD probes in this class are good to 1200° ...

That should do! When we get the nice spring temps I will set up a test. Only way to be comparing apples to apples, will be to test the original, cool down, then remove and replace the original with test RTD. Currently plan to run each at first 225* for one hour and record the most stable temp and for how long it took to get there, and how long it was stable. Then up the temp to 500* for the same test. After that is done will cool down, remove the old and install the new, and repeat those tests again, the next day at the same time in the same weather. I think that would be worth the effort. If results show no difference, then I will have a spare RTD. If one set is erratic compared to the other, then out it goes. If it is the old set that goes, then we have accomplished something, but if it is the new set, then lesson learned--go back to cooking hot and sears.

 

[rfdong]

they were lower at low temps ( initial start up ) by about 15° ,,, buy the time the grill stabilized set at 200° the thermoworks read around 8° high,,, and the gap grew from there,,, set at 250° the gap was almost 25°... and at 375° the gap was 80°... and that is with the thermoworks probe placed in its clip right beside the RTD... So far I haven't experienced any of this with the shorter RTD... This weekend I am going to continue my testing by moving the thermoworks probe to the center of the cooking surface and see the differences... I am expecting there will be a difference ,,, but I am hoping the temp gap will be consistent throughout the temp range like it is now with the thermoworks probe right next to the RTD,,, and then a quick one time offset adjustment will take care of it...
This is the RTD I have installed at the moment...

Replacement RTD High-Temperature Meat Probe Sensor, Barbecue Waterproof Probe Sensor for Pit Boss Probe PB1000XL-025-R00 https://www.amazon.com/dp/B085MBYFG...a_i_CK9SCK3DN7221DBA402B?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1

Is this probe plug and play? Or does5(3 connector need modification?

 

[680bear]

Is this probe plug and play? Or does5(3 connector need modification?

it's all plug and play,,, they are 2 wire probes...

 

[680bear]

UPDATE: So here are the most recent results of my testing,,, and I believe the last modifications I will need to do... Previously I had changed the RTD probe out to a shorter and I believe higher quality version,,, that brought my offset temps to tighter ratio,,, then I added the tray of ceramic briquets to the top of the diverter,,, this tightened the offset even more and helped eliminate the hotspot in the center of the grill surface,,, the extra weight also completely eliminated the warping issue I had been having with the diverter... my final test was to use only one layer of ceramic briquets and place a 3/8" steel plate over them on top of the diverter (this is the plate I used

Hot Rolled Steel Plate 3/8" x 12" x 12" https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00YWBRMP...a_i_B741RC47EMNHV60T71TG?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1 ) the results were happily positive,,, the offset setting across the temp range was reduced again to +/- 3 points and that is close enough that I don't feel the need to adjust it when cooking at higher temps,,, the best result from all of this though,,, there is only a 7° degree difference from the left to the right side of the grill surface,,, and the temp holds closer after opening the lid,,, no more big spikes... this has been a fun experiment and if it helps anyone out with their grill it was all worth it... Thank you all for your interest and positive support...

 

[fullhouse32]

Thank you for sharing. This will come in handy for sure. Looking forward to the pictures.

 

[TyYoda]

so things have been working relatively well with the pit boss probe,,, I unfortunately don't have the specifics on the internal construction of the PB probe wether it's platinum or copper or nickel,,, but it is clearly out performing the original RecTec probe...
Next up for testing is the Savannah Stoker probe,,,
https://www.savannahstoker.com/products/grill-temperature-sensor
it is a platinum RTD,,, all the specs are on their site,,,
I work with a number of different types of RTD probes at work and are designed for an industrial setting in harsh environments,,, the probes that are in these grills are simply stripped down versions of simular 2 wire probes,,, they are simple devices that change their resistance value along an assumed temperature range,,, accuracy is determined by the quality of the material used in it's construction,,, and the quality of the device and the programming in the device... I am somewhat convinced the device/controller is a quality device,,, I am very suspect on the quality of the RTD probe supplied with the grill...

How much better was the more expensive Savanah probe versus the Bitt Boss probe?

 

[TyYoda]

Another question, did you try the ceramic briquettes directly on top of the diverter without a pan or steel plate?

 

[680bear]

Another question, did you try the ceramic briquettes directly on top of the diverter without a pan or steel plate?

No,,, I only used the pan to keep them clustered together in case the diverter warped...

 

[okie]

I assume that the load of pan/briquets/steel plate does not interfere with the placement of the drip pan (the space between is limited)? Bit more of a chore when cleaning? Warm up time extended?

I like the results with the shortened RTD but wonder if you could have achieved the result with the temp diversity, by just moving the diffuser a bit off center to deflect the heat more to the weak side? We old Traeger owners did that with great success. As I recall, I had a 15*-20* difference on left and right sides of the grates and moving the diffuser about 1/2 inch did the trick.
However, it appears that you have resolved the problems very well to your desires. Congratulations.

PS. I have decided not to replace the RTD on the 380. I use it for hot/sear/medium temp short(chicken) cooks and use my 590 for the Low/Slow. The Offset changes I made earlier seem to have been satisfactory for the 380.